View Poll Results: Your Favorite Bike Frame Material
Voters: 71. You may not vote on this poll
Titanium Bikes: Are They Worth it?
10-15-24, 02:12 PM
#76
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No. Stainless steel does rust. At least under the right conditions. Those “right conditions” just happen to be ones that we humans like to make, at least in places where it snows. Salt, or more specifically, the chloride ions in some salts have an affinity for iron and even the chromium in steels. It plucks the iron atoms out of the matrix making them into iron chloride which then rapidly converts to iron oxide while releasing the chloride ions which then go back to pluck out more iron atoms. The cycle continues until the chloride is removed. (A similar mechanism happens with aluminum.) The problem is worse for some grades of stainless.
The reason that titanium tubing even exists is because of this kind of problem. Titanium tubing was developed because of the need to handle chemicals that are corrosive to steel and even 316L stainless (not used in bicycle frames). Titanium is inert to most chemicals, especially under the conditions we cyclist use them for.
The reason that titanium tubing even exists is because of this kind of problem. Titanium tubing was developed because of the need to handle chemicals that are corrosive to steel and even 316L stainless (not used in bicycle frames). Titanium is inert to most chemicals, especially under the conditions we cyclist use them for.
10-15-24, 02:16 PM
#77
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10-15-24, 02:23 PM
#79
Start raking.
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10-15-24, 02:24 PM
#80
Senior Member
My old bike from 1970s is then not stainless steel but just steel I suppose because its frame is rusted quite a bit. When new, in those days it was a sort of what you would call a training bike for racers or a beginner racer bike, wasn't too expensive. I guess the frame can't be iron but steel, just not a stainless steel.
10-15-24, 02:48 PM
#81
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My old bike from 1970s is then not stainless steel but just steel I suppose because its frame is rusted quite a bit. When new, in those days it was a sort of what you would call a training bike for racers or a beginner racer bike, wasn't too expensive. I guess the frame can't be iron but steel, just not a stainless steel.
10-15-24, 03:02 PM
#82
With a mighty wind
On this forum, lots of members think that bike technology peaked at 3x7. I’m not sure how useful their advice about frame material is.
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10-15-24, 04:06 PM
#83
Mad bike riding scientist
Join Date: Nov 2004
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Bikes: Some silver ones, a red one, a black and orange one, and a few titanium ones
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Don’t believe me? How about guys who make stainless steel?
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Stuart Black
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Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
10-15-24, 04:43 PM
#84
Clark W. Griswold
Join Date: Mar 2014
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I guess I missed most of this one but as someone who has 2 titanium bikes and another frame that I need to rebuild into something fun. I have plans for a few other titanium bikes as well. Basically I would happily replace a good portion of my fleet with titanium if I could.
Yes titanium isn't always perfect and certainly won't do everything but it rides nice, is easy to keep clean and looks really good without much care. A frame I don't have to paint is great as I worry about it less. I can give it some abuse and it won't look like crap.
Yes titanium isn't always perfect and certainly won't do everything but it rides nice, is easy to keep clean and looks really good without much care. A frame I don't have to paint is great as I worry about it less. I can give it some abuse and it won't look like crap.
10-15-24, 06:02 PM
#85
Advocatus Diaboli
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What's the comparative volume of Lynskey, Merlin, Moots recalls vs Trek, Specialized, etc?
10-15-24, 06:24 PM
#86
Clark W. Griswold
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It has got to be pretty low. But I think Moots and Merlin and other similar manufacturers probably have some higher QC at all levels and much smaller production values so they can really keep a better eye on it. I think as well the US ti manufacturers are using less odd ball OEM only stuff as most of their customers aren't interested in saving money for a generic crank with some different affixing bolt.
10-15-24, 07:03 PM
#87
Senior Member
All the steel frames that were tested failed before the completion of testing, too. The only frames that survived the test were a Trek carbon frame, a Cannondale aluminum frame, and a Principia aluminum frame.
The testers said that all the steel and titanium frames that failed would likely have survived had they been built with better QC or slightly more conservative design (e.g., slightly thicker tubing at highly stressed locations in the frame).
10-15-24, 07:20 PM
#88
Sunshine
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It has got to be pretty low. But I think Moots and Merlin and other similar manufacturers probably have some higher QC at all levels and much smaller production values so they can really keep a better eye on it. I think as well the US ti manufacturers are using less odd ball OEM only stuff as most of their customers aren't interested in saving money for a generic crank with some different affixing bolt.
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10-15-24, 07:49 PM
#89
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FWIW, the famous 1997 German Tour magazine article presenting the results of a frame fatigue text they'd commissioned (13 high-end frames built by a variety of manufacturers using various materials) reported that both titanium frames that were tested failed (one at a down tube shifter boss, the other at a down tube bottle cage boss).
All the steel frames that were tested failed before the completion of testing, too. The only frames that survived the test were a Trek carbon frame, a Cannondale aluminum frame, and a Principia aluminum frame.
The testers said that all the steel and titanium frames that failed would likely have survived had they been built with better QC or slightly more conservative design (e.g., slightly thicker tubing at highly stressed locations in the frame).
All the steel frames that were tested failed before the completion of testing, too. The only frames that survived the test were a Trek carbon frame, a Cannondale aluminum frame, and a Principia aluminum frame.
The testers said that all the steel and titanium frames that failed would likely have survived had they been built with better QC or slightly more conservative design (e.g., slightly thicker tubing at highly stressed locations in the frame).
It shows the difference between materials - at the same diameter - which is why different materials have different diameters when used as a frame material.
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10-15-24, 07:54 PM
#90
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Ahh, I'm sorry you didn't get a rise, try Viagra...
10-15-24, 09:02 PM
#91
10-15-24, 09:50 PM
#92
We (my wife's bike) have a raw titanium bike frame. I have a grey Rav4. The car (as well as its color) is boring. It is a car. It is also full of sand and dog hair. Who cares?
The raw Ti bike frame I think has a nice aesthetic. (I would prefer anodized graphics to the decals it has.)
My custom steel bike has a "boring" black finish, with light blue graphics. It is understated, but I like it.
I also like Indy's bike's finish.
They would all be great on a nice bike ride in Oregon:
The raw Ti bike frame I think has a nice aesthetic. (I would prefer anodized graphics to the decals it has.)
My custom steel bike has a "boring" black finish, with light blue graphics. It is understated, but I like it.
I also like Indy's bike's finish.
They would all be great on a nice bike ride in Oregon:
10-15-24, 10:14 PM
#93
Firm but gentle
My friends rode from Alaska to Argentina, then around the world through Siberia, all of it on XT 3x7. About 20 years ago we were looking at their long-retired mountain bikes hanging on the wall. "In all that riding I never missed a shift, never..."
You yourself said your Ekar was a disappointment and not precise, but by God it is better than a 3x7!
The only advice I would seek from you is how to smell my own farts.
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10-16-24, 04:42 AM
#94
For The Fun of It
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I built my Lynskeys because they had very good deals on frames. Litespeed rarely has great deals on frames. They are both fantastic in my experience. The Backroad and the GR300 are unequivocally the best bikes I have ever owned.
10-16-24, 06:14 AM
#95
Senior Member
I simply don't think the "upgrade" if it is an upgrade over aluminum is worth the expense. If Aluminum often failed and Titanium never failed the price might be justified. Titanium has just as much or possibly greater potential to fail as aluminum and is unrepairable when it does.
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10-16-24, 07:10 AM
#96
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I simply don't think the "upgrade" if it is an upgrade over aluminum is worth the expense. If Aluminum often failed and Titanium never failed the price might be justified. Titanium has just as much or possibly greater potential to fail as aluminum and is unrepairable when it does.
Last edited by 13ollocks; 10-16-24 at 07:20 AM.
10-16-24, 07:25 AM
#97
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A 105 equipped Lightspeed is almost $2500 more than a 105 equipped good aluminum bike. Worth it? I don't know.
The 105 Lynskey is on sale and is only$1200 more than a 105 aluminum bike - and the Lynskey has decent wheels in the base spec. Worth it? HMMMMMM, that bike has me thinking.
10-16-24, 07:32 AM
#98
Senior Member
When did it become “titanium vs aluminum”? All of the major materials have pros and cons - Ti is no different. It’s not the cheapest, but it brings reasonable lightness, a good ride, low maintenance and durability to the table. Can it fail? Sure, like any other material, but I have yet to see any evidence of “greater potential” to fail -whatever that means. Everything has “potential” to fail 🙄 whether or not they actually fail is the issue. Apart from some anecdotes, I have seen no evidence that Ti fails at any higher frequency than any other material. And it is absolutely repairable - it’s likely not cheap and only a few places (eg Ti Cycles) can do it, but it’s doable
I am not arguing that titanium has any greater failure rate than any other material, but I don't think it can be argued that it has less either. I've ridden titanium and I can't tell much difference between it any other material,so for my use it's just not worth the extra expense. YMMV
10-16-24, 07:43 AM
#99
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The OP asked if TI is worth it and had a poll about what the group prefers. So, all materials are on the table.
Ti vs Alu - purely in the "worth it" context. (leaving out the "want it" argument, or the what will assplode first argument)
You can get 2 decent Alu bikes, similarly equipped, for the price of one Ti bike. Same group set, same quality wheels +/-, similar weight, ride characteristics will be fairly similar, durability will be fairly similar - is the Ti bike worth it?
I say no. But that's my opinion about just the "worth it" argument.
Ti vs Alu - purely in the "worth it" context. (leaving out the "want it" argument, or the what will assplode first argument)
You can get 2 decent Alu bikes, similarly equipped, for the price of one Ti bike. Same group set, same quality wheels +/-, similar weight, ride characteristics will be fairly similar, durability will be fairly similar - is the Ti bike worth it?
I say no. But that's my opinion about just the "worth it" argument.
10-16-24, 08:06 AM
#100
Senior Member
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