ruiner

I have to disagree also with your second point's validity. Fat can be burned effectively with 0% of your diet coming from carbohydrates. You will do so as long as you are doing the following: getting adequate calories from proteins and unsaturated fats and getting enough rest and exercise. Even if your goal isn't to burn fat, for instance to compete in marathon races, you can still utilize fats for your only source of energy production so long as you follow the rules for endurance fueling.

But diets like this should be restricted only to the carbohydrate sensitive because, in practice, it is tough! Getting used to it takes about two weeks. The foods are lean meats/shellfish and nuts/oils/seeds. I used to love peanut butter. Now not so much. But it's a price I'm willing to pay since the alternative is feeling like crap after eating any type of carbohydrate and being tired all day. Now I have gobs of energy and endurance is not a problem.

paggnr

Use Beta Alanine.

Lactic Acid is caused (chemically) by the build up of Hydrogen in the muscle due to breakdown. The build up of H+ causes the muscle to become acidic. Beta Alanine 'blocks' (reduces) the build up of H+ therefore allowing the muscle to work longer before LA.

koffee brown

Ummmm... no it isn't. Fats are NOT burned effectively with your primary fuel source coming from a high protein diet. Congratulations, though! You've just described ketosis! Welcome to the starvation diet of the 90s!

It may be time for you to take another look at the Krebs cycle again- I'm reading what you're saying and seeing that you don't have quite a grasp on nutrition and basic biochemistry.

koffee

koffee brown

I'm not sure why you're asking this. Why would you need glucose in a supplement form? Your body has plenty of it stored in the muscles and liver. When you do fall short of what you need, you can get from a good nutrition plan.

koffee

ruiner

Don't emphasize the "NOT" in all capital letters, it sort of implies something which isn't true. You should instead have said "Fats are not burned AS effectively on a protein only diet..." To which I would agree. But stating that fats cannot be burned on a protein/fat diet is pure horse****.

Also, while calling it a starvation diet is accurate, such wording would lead to someone coming to the conclusion that it is ineffective to the point of decreased metabolic rate, or that it would deplete muscle stores to fuel the body, and that is most certainly not the case. By definition it is a starvation diet as far as biology is concerned, but there is a stark contrast between fat/protein diets and calorie-deficient diets. In the former case muscle mass is preserved and the brain can function normally utilizing ketones. Not so in the latter.

fietser_ivana

Lots and lots and lots of practice helps.
As supplements: beta-alanine (I'm using Karno4 myself) helps.
As food source: try to push up your fat-oxidation by staying low carb on recovery days and the fuel your ride by carbs on cycling days. If the ride is very long, do a carb up the night before.

I'm seeing proponets of both a high carb/low-fat (15% fats is looooooooooooow!!!) and a low-carb/high fat diet. It all depends on
- what type of rides you do: slower endurance or faster performance rides (sounds like the latter but am not sure)
- if you're insulin resistant or not. From 2002-2003 I was on a near exclusively (cyclical) ketogenic diet and yet did just fine on longer rides of up to 375 mi/600K (brevets). At the time i was quite insulin resistant. Nowadays I'd not be able to go for longer than 1-2 hrs w/o carbs as carbs are now the preferred fuel.

With more carbs as fuel you automatically will get more lactic acid build-up. That's why it even pays for someone insulin sensitive to push up the lactic acid threshold by training it. Beta-alanine can help to clear it faster (or actually get it recycled faster). Especially useful when you're not able/willing to train for it as much.

koffee brown

Ok, Grammar Nazi. First, what I said is exactly the statement you just reworded. But if it helps to reword so you understand what I'm saying, gooooooooo right ahead. I didn't say fats CANNOT be burned on a protein/fat diet. That's absurd- look at the Krebs Cycle in a diagram sometime. The deamination of amino acids formed from oxidation of proteins produce a ketoacid that directly enters the Krebs Cycle to produce ATP. You won't get as many ATP as carbohydrate metabolism, but you'll get some ATP generation. This is not what we want. We eat proteins so we can use those amino acids produced from protein metabolism for other necessary chemical reactions in the body (i.e. enzymes are proteins that act as catalysts to drive chemical reactions in the body). But- if we have limited carbohydrates and fats energy stores, the body will go to proteins for its energy source. If you try to rely on this method for energy, under most normal circumstances, you may end up compromising your own bodily functions. I wouldn't do it- but that's MY choice.

As far as your notion that the brain can survive normally on a fats/proteins diet (which I interpret to mean as opposed to a carbohydrate richer diet (50- 55% of diet from carbs), that is not so. The brain gets its fuel source only from carbohydrates- not fats, and not proteins. So it's difficult to address that other little part of your statement. Sorry.

koffee

koffee brown

P.S. Hi Ivana. Long time.

kb

fietser_ivana

Actually, the brain can and does use ketones for enenergy, but it will always need approx. 100g of glucose that the body will derive from protein. Most of it seems actually to be needed for the eyes.
To an extent a ketodiet is more protein-sparing than being on a low-calorie higher carb diet. But once you are exercising hard, the rules are different again.
Still if you must be dumb and eat a very low calorie diet, while exercising lots, muscles would probably be better conserved with a ketodiet.. but only by a slim margin.
A smarter approach is to fuel high intensity effort in order to prevent muscle breakdown and use a (semi-)ketodiet on other days of the week.