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First Crit, First Big Crash

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First Crit, First Big Crash

Old 03-27-07, 09:57 PM
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First Crit, First Big Crash

I want to say hello to the racing section.
To start off, I am new to cycling. I come from a background of Road and trail running. I've tried team sports but they do not suit me well. I got my first road bike less than a month ago because I get bored with running only and I need a competative outlet.
During the warm months there is a local industrial park crit so I decided to give it a try. The format is 45 minutes plus 2 with no class breakup. The course is a basic square with 4 right hand turns. I arrived later than I planned so I didn't warm up like I should have. As I was riding out of the parking lot I noticed a curb I didn't want to ride down so I tried to pull my feet out of the pedals (not clipless yet), and tipped over. No problem, just stupid.
I pulled up to the line as they were lining up. Rules are stated and the race starts.
First lap was really slow, I was on the back on the inside. Second lap sees the pace pick up and I moved closer to 2/3rds of the way back in the pack. 3rd lap is more of the same, but I was moving towards the outside as the inside was freaking me out a bit. By the time lap 4 rolls around the pace has really picked up and I was on the very outside and in the back. As I roll into turn 4 I realize it is far and away the sharpest on the course and I was not at all leaning over far enough. I watched the curb loom closer, and then I was on my side in the grass.
Apparently, my tires hit the curb and pitched me over. My left shoulder slammed into the ground. There are a few scrapes on the bike, but nothing major. A local rider stopped to see if I was ok and helped me reattach as the pack went by. I was skittish, but he helped me grab a wheel. I dropped after 2 laps OTB with shoulder pain.

So here I am, my first race, my first crash, and it hurts like no ones business to move my arm. Provided I heal up, next week will see me out there again.
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Old 03-27-07, 10:26 PM
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Hope you recover quickly and get back out there! Practice following one person around. Stick on them like a tick! If they can make it around the turn, so can you.
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Old 03-27-07, 11:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Bantam
I've tried team sports but they do not suit me well.
Hate to be picky... but you do realize that cycling is a team sport?
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Old 03-28-07, 12:02 AM
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Originally Posted by digitoast
Hate to be picky... but you do realize that cycling is a team sport?
i don't think he's racing with the elite just yet.
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Old 03-28-07, 12:03 AM
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Originally Posted by digitoast
Hate to be picky... but you do realize that cycling can be a team sport?
Fixed that for you.
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Old 03-28-07, 12:05 AM
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Good luck out there and glad to hear that you've survived with flying colors!
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Old 03-28-07, 01:02 AM
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At least you got the embarsssing first crash out of the way!! Now its plain sailing all the way!
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Old 03-28-07, 02:06 AM
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"Aiyahh... Oh no..."

At least yours was in the heat of battle.

Did you have your shoulder checked out in an ER or something? If the pain is as significant as it sounds, it would probably be a good idea.
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Old 03-28-07, 04:07 AM
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That is almost exactly how I picture my first race...Heal up the unknown is behind you.
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Old 03-28-07, 06:02 AM
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Originally Posted by digitoast
Hate to be picky... but you do realize that cycling is a team sport?
I know it can be, but I have 3-10 years before I'm at that level if I actually get there. Even then it's a team sport in a totally different way. I have Cerebral Palsy that affects my left hand so catching (insert ball or disc) is somewhat of an issue, I was always saved by being able to run fast.

i don't think he's racing with the elite just yet.
There are a few 2s and maybe a 1, but they stay at the front and I never saw them until I dropped.

"Aiyahh... Oh no..."

At least yours was in the heat of battle.

Did you have your shoulder checked out in an ER or something? If the pain is as significant as it sounds, it would probably be a good idea.
No, I didn't get it checked, I have 2 exams today so I came home and studied. After sleeping on it I think the pain is from slammig on the muscles and not the actual joint.
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Old 03-28-07, 06:19 AM
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Is it just me or do others think maybe Bantam may need to learn some bike-handling skills before entering a mass-start race?
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Old 03-28-07, 06:22 AM
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Originally Posted by galen_52657
Is it just me or do others think maybe Bantam may need to learn some bike-handling skills before entering a mass-start race?
+1

Bantam - find some groups and/or a local racing team and do some riding with them, that will help you with attaining some skills needed to keep you safe and avoid being a hazard to others.

Also - bicycling is alot like driving - look where you want to go, not at what you want to avoid.
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Old 03-28-07, 06:52 AM
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Yes not to sound elitest in anyway, but you could be a serious danger to the rest of the pack unless you pick up some bike handeling skills.

I would go back next week and watch the crit, then after its finished try to find some riders and talk with them and tell them you would like ride in this crit but you would like to ride in a bit of a pack first.
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Old 03-28-07, 07:07 AM
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I have to agree with the group ride suggestion. Only having a road bike for a month is not a lot of experience. Find the group training rides that the guys doing the race do. You'll get plenty of training doing those rides and some bike handling confidence. Also you can talk to and learn from those guys.

Do that for a couple of months, and you'll be much more comfortable doing the crit next time.
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Old 03-28-07, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by galen_52657
Is it just me or do others think maybe Bantam may need to learn some bike-handling skills before entering a mass-start race?
Yes, that is on the to do list. I've been on a few group rides so far. Not enough I think.
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Old 03-28-07, 09:04 AM
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well... sounds like this IS a practice crit—no real pressure; get back on when they come around. so besides fast group rides this is a good way to get comfy in the pack.
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Old 03-28-07, 04:06 PM
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The x-rays told the doctor I have contused my shoulder. 48 hours of ice and Tylenol and a sling is the Rx.
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Old 03-28-07, 08:37 PM
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well, i too participated in the crit, it was my first race as well. I didnt crash but i came close in the same corner that bantam did. Bantam, while not having ridden a road bike for very long is no stranger to cornering. The main problem with the group rides around here are that they are all either like 3 people, or REALY slow, Like 13 mph pace, im gonna talk more than i pedal type rides.

Ive been riding bikes seriously for almost 3 years, road bikes almost 2, and my bike handling skills are pretty good, but this was my first REAL pack experiance.

BTW it is a practice Crit
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Old 03-29-07, 03:59 AM
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Originally Posted by steaktaco
well... sounds like this IS a practice crit—no real pressure; get back on when they come around. so besides fast group rides this is a good way to get comfy in the pack.
That's what I thought, too. Since this was not a class start and he didn't even say anything about getting a one day license, it sounded like a "line up and let's go" deal. And since the lower cats and newbies will not be able to keep up with the better riders, it all sorts itself out in the end anyway.

It sounded like a perfect deal for a new racer wanting to get experience.

BTW...one of the biggest mistakes I see made consistently by riders is not understanding how to ride a course from different lines at speed.
When an auto racer goes out to qualify, they can drive any line they want, but they want the fastest one. Their car is set up in a different way than for the race where the other cars might dictate the line they can take. So, they practice running different lines, especially through turns for race setup.
Bike racing's the same. In other words, if you ride the course for a warm up mostly alone, you'll ride whatever line you want. Suddenly, in a pack you are forceed to take the line from the inside at 25mph and realize that you might not make it. So you practice that before the race...taking five or six different entry and exit lines through turns at racing speed so that you are capable of doing that in the race. If you realize you can't do a particular entry point safely, you set that up BEFORE you get into the turn, and avoid falling and taking a bunch of people with you.

Last edited by roadwarrior; 03-29-07 at 04:19 AM.
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Old 03-29-07, 05:50 AM
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I'll pitch in a bit too. I think bantam you must be feeling a bit beat up, and not just your shoulder.

I think it's great that you entered the practice crit but from your description, there seems to be a few things you can work on to prevent this from happening again.

First, when you're in a crit, as you learned, you rarely have the opportunity to follow your own line. Instead, you're forced to follow others. Since the rider in front of you probably has no significant equipment differences, it should be possible to simply follow their line. This is a great way to corner safely in a big field, even when you have no idea what's happening with the course - just follow what the guy in front is doing.

Sitting on the inside actually gives you a lot of "error" room. The only thing is that the other riders are your buffer. If you make a mistake, they pay for it. However, it's a good place to witness the semi-chaotic situation you always see on the inside of corners.

The outside is a faster but more dangerous place to be. Anyone who crashes will slide out and take you out. Or if they avoid a pothole or make some other riding error, they'll be heading your way.

Second, there are two ways to corner. One maximizes stability, the other maximizes the ability to change your line (at least where the tires go). The stable way to corner is to hunker down and lean the bike and yourself about the same (or you can lean yourself a bit more, but usually you both lean the same). It's stable because your bike is happy resisting cornering forces vertically, i.e. there is very little lateral stress on the wheels, fork, etc.

The second way to corner is to lean your bike more than your body. Since your bike weighs less than your body, you can radically alter its course while your body moves only a little. You can use this technique to, say, avoid a fallen rider in the middle of the turn. The second type of maneuver might have kept you upright a bit longer, enough to either unclip or brake a bit.

Incidentally, when you're in a pack and you see a pothole or something, do NOT swerve to avoid it. Taking out 5 or 10 riders is not a good thing. Suck it up and hit it, unweighting the saddle if you can. Or use the first technique below to avoid it.

Third, it's important to learn some basic riding techniques (and this is beyond simply riding in a group):
1. Bunny hops - if you can bunny hop your bike, you'll give yourself a new out in a situation like your crash. Instead of watching the curb take out your wheels, you can simply bunny hop up it. (Plus you can ride around campus easier if you can bunny hop). One of my first races I went into the final corner of a road race way too hot (40+ mph at the bottom of a descent) and realized I wasn't going to make it, just like you in your crit. I straightened out, bunny hopped the curb, and disappeared into the woods. Other than a lot of scratches from a prickly bush, I was fine. You risk damaging your wheels/tires but I've used bunnyhops when I've gotten pushed off the course, ridden along the sidewalk or grass, and jumped back in (carefully).

2. Cornering on the drops. I'm making an assumption and we know that sometimes backfires - I'm assuming you weren't on your drops or your bars are set a bit high. If you go into a turn at the same speed as everyone else, even a bit faster, and you don't make it, you probably didn't have enough weight on the front of the bike. Weight on the front of the bike allows you to turn more aggressively, brake aggressively, and do some radical maneuvers to tighten your line (like you can skid your rear wheel and slide a bit before trying to recover, or stop, or reduce your impact speed). I see way too many racers (I promote races as well as race them) racing hard on the hoods and sitting too far back on the bike while cornering.

Hoods means you're putting more weight on the seat, i.e. moving your weight rearward, and you take perhaps 30-50% of your braking force away simply because you can't adjust your weight when you grab your brakes. Being on the drops is much better. If your drops are a bit high, lowering them a bit might be something to look into.

Slide forward on the seat a bit to push the front wheel down. It's amazing how hard you can corner when your front wheel doesn't slide. Just don't touch your rear brake because it'll probably lock up pretty quickly. Which brings me to...

3. Braking. You should practice all out braking. Even if there is nothing you can do to avoid a crash, slowing down will reduce the impact. All out braking involves using both brakes and practicing stopping hard enough that the rear wheel starts to either lift or skid. That is your tipping point, i.e. at that moment your bike is slowing about as hard as it can. Try and repeat this braking exercise so the rear wheel gets light. Move your butt behind the seat to keep weight as far back as possible. Now try it on the hoods. Very difficult to stop on the hoods. When I do panic stops, I am braking with my front brake perhaps 90% of my stopping power, the rear is very slight. The rear wheel only exists to notify me when the bike is about to tip over. I practice braking every time I end my ride - I ride up to my car or my house and stop firmly enough to lift the rear wheel just a hair.

4. The final thing is learn how to fall. I took Judo and really only learned one thing - how to tumble. One of the exercises I had to do was jump over 3-5 guys standing with their heads tilted down. I'd land from about 5+ feet in the air on a mat and tumble to a standing position and repeat perhaps 10 or 15 times. This is almost exactly like crashing off a bike if you go over the bike (vs slide). Perhaps there is some free Judo classes there (or some other non-punching type thing like gymnastics). Once you get the technique it's a matter of trying a bit.

Finally, if you're in a race and find yourself off the back, use the time to corner as hard as possible. I find it's incredible how hard you can corner given a clear road. My first race I was off the back and a teammate caught up to me. He yelled at me to corner like I wanted to fall over. I did and I was flying. We chased a bit but never made it back on (you rarely do). At least I learned another element of racing that day.

I can't say I never crash - in fact, I used to crash quite often. But knowing these techniques will make the crashes less frequent and hopefully less painful.

I hope this helps. Get your shoulder healed and good luck in your next race,
cdr

*edit* was wrong about tyler's crash so took it out

Last edited by carpediemracing; 03-29-07 at 06:52 AM.
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Old 03-29-07, 06:01 AM
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^^^^^
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Old 03-29-07, 06:26 AM
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Originally Posted by roadwarrior
That's what I thought, too. Since this was not a class start and he didn't even say anything about getting a one day license, it sounded like a "line up and let's go" deal. And since the lower cats and newbies will not be able to keep up with the better riders, it all sorts itself out in the end anyway.

It sounded like a perfect deal for a new racer wanting to get experience.

.

There's a differnece between a new racer and a new rider. Thep OP says he's been riding a bike for a month. I'd suggest that anyone new to cycling spend a litle time becoming a competent bike rider before they start racing.

I don't think people should be put off from starting racing, but if its your first season on the bike, I don't think it is at all unreasonable to suggest doing group rides for a month or two before racing, even a practice crit.

There are simple group riding skills that you need to have, that are better learnedin a non competitive environment.

I can't imagine learning to race crits without putting in at least a couple a hunderd miles riding in groups with other folks
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Old 03-29-07, 06:42 AM
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+1 Very well said Merlin.

Even if it is a practice crit, being new to cycling and riding in packs, you can put others in danger. Even experienced racers make stupid mistakes, but not having a lot of experience with racing at high speeds with a bunch of other guys is probably not a good idea.

Get experience riding in groups/pacelines first.
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Old 03-29-07, 08:34 AM
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BTW...one of the biggest mistakes I see made consistently by riders is not understanding how to ride a course from different lines at speed.
When an auto racer goes out to qualify, they can drive any line they want, but they want the fastest one. Their car is set up in a different way than for the race where the other cars might dictate the line they can take. So, they practice running different lines, especially through turns for race setup.
Bike racing's the same. In other words, if you ride the course for a warm up mostly alone, you'll ride whatever line you want. Suddenly, in a pack you are forceed to take the line from the inside at 25mph and realize that you might not make it. So you practice that before the race...taking five or six different entry and exit lines through turns at racing speed so that you are capable of doing that in the race. If you realize you can't do a particular entry point safely, you set that up BEFORE you get into the turn, and avoid falling and taking a bunch of people with you.
One of my problems was that I arrived later than I intended to and didn't get much time on the course itself before the pace picked up.
Before cycling I rode Downhill and longboard skateboards. I used to love late night parking garage runs because they were fast, and the technical turns helped with cornering experience, the elevator ride to the top was nice also. I would mess around with entry, exit, apex points, speed, and drifting so I could adjust when we would race and my prefered line was taken. I know a good bit about cornering theory, I'm just trying to translate it to the bike now.

The second way to corner is to lean your bike more than your body. Since your bike weighs less than your body, you can radically alter its course while your body moves only a little. You can use this technique to, say, avoid a fallen rider in the middle of the turn. The second type of maneuver might have kept you upright a bit longer, enough to either unclip or brake a bit.
Thank you cdr, there was a lot of good stuff in your post and I think it will help me out a lot. I'm not feeling too beat up. My shoulder is getting better and I've been around enough forums to have built a nice flak sheild.
Anyways, I have not yet switched to clipless pedals, and I think that had a significant impact on how I landed. I would have had plenty of time to unclip, and maybe enough time to avoid the problem, but I didn't want to make a sudden movement and crash someone else.
2. Cornering on the drops. I'm making an assumption and we know that sometimes backfires - I'm assuming you weren't on your drops or your bars are set a bit high. If you go into a turn at the same speed as everyone else, even a bit faster, and you don't make it, you probably didn't have enough weight on the front of the bike. Weight on the front of the bike allows you to turn more aggressively, brake aggressively, and do some radical maneuvers to tighten your line (like you can skid your rear wheel and slide a bit before trying to recover, or stop, or reduce your impact speed). I see way too many racers (I promote races as well as race them) racing hard on the hoods and sitting too far back on the bike while cornering.
You assumed right as I was very much on the hoods, something to work on.
4. The final thing is learn how to fall. I took Judo and really only learned one thing - how to tumble. One of the exercises I had to do was jump over 3-5 guys standing with their heads tilted down. I'd land from about 5+ feet in the air on a mat and tumble to a standing position and repeat perhaps 10 or 15 times. This is almost exactly like crashing off a bike if you go over the bike (vs slide). Perhaps there is some free Judo classes there (or some other non-punching type thing like gymnastics). Once you get the technique it's a matter of trying a bit.
As I mentioned earlier, I have a skateboarding background, so I am very good at absorbing impact. I just could not tuck and roll with a bike straped to my feet.

PS: Anyone want to buy a longboard so I can buy shoes and pedals?
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Old 03-29-07, 08:46 AM
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Learn to Counter Steer. Sounds like you just tightened up on your bike, makes it impossible to add lean angle.
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