Sugino 75 = ISO, just to clarify
#1
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Sugino 75 = ISO, just to clarify
I brought this up in that other thread but figured I'd restate it for those planning on buying Sugino 75 cranks and opting for a different bottom bracket than the standard S75 track BB w/ unsealed bearings. Sugino 75's take an ISO taper bottom bracket, not JIS like everyone has assumed when they suggested running it with a Shimano UN5X/7X BB.
But don't take my word for it:
But don't take my word for it:
kozo sugino <kozo@suginoltd.co.jp> to me
show details Mar 18 (22 hours ago)
Dear Mr. _____,
Thank you for your contact.
SUGINO 75 cranks are using ISO square taper.
Shinano UN53 is using JIS square taper and does not fit the crank.
Campagnolo is using ISO and will fit with 111mm.
Regards,
Kozo
**************************************
SUGINO CYCLE INDUSTRIES, LTD.
287-1 Tohkujyo-cho, Nara 630-8144JAPAN
Tel: (81)742-62-5311 Fax: (81)742-62-5320
**************************************
show details Mar 18 (22 hours ago)
Dear Mr. _____,
Thank you for your contact.
SUGINO 75 cranks are using ISO square taper.
Shinano UN53 is using JIS square taper and does not fit the crank.
Campagnolo is using ISO and will fit with 111mm.
Regards,
Kozo
**************************************
SUGINO CYCLE INDUSTRIES, LTD.
287-1 Tohkujyo-cho, Nara 630-8144JAPAN
Tel: (81)742-62-5311 Fax: (81)742-62-5320
**************************************
#4
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I asked him about 111mm Campy BB specifically in my original question. Chainline is perfect on my bike. In theory it could knock it off by 1mm, though.
#7
aka mattio
okay, so, i seem to recall something written maybe by the folks over at Phil Wood. i can't be the only person to remember this - can anybody help de-fuzzy my memory? basically, they said that for all Sugino's claims that it's ISO and other people's claims that it's JIS, it's actually somewhere in between the two - of course it takes some instruments to measure the very slight differences. and then they went on to say some other stuff, but dammit if i can't remember where it was written - here? their website? - or what exactly it said.
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Well this complicates things.
John at Businesscycles lists Sugino cranks as ISO, but other sellers list Sugino cranks as JIS.
I had assumed that Sugino made two different cranks.
By the way, John at Businesscycles recommends matching the crank bearing spindle manufacturer to the crank arm manufacturer.
So much for my plan of getting a Sugino 75 crank and putting it on the same Phil spindle I use for my Stronglight crank.
John at Businesscycles lists Sugino cranks as ISO, but other sellers list Sugino cranks as JIS.
I had assumed that Sugino made two different cranks.
By the way, John at Businesscycles recommends matching the crank bearing spindle manufacturer to the crank arm manufacturer.
So much for my plan of getting a Sugino 75 crank and putting it on the same Phil spindle I use for my Stronglight crank.
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Originally Posted by queerpunk
okay, so, i seem to recall something written maybe by the folks over at Phil Wood. i can't be the only person to remember this - can anybody help de-fuzzy my memory? basically, they said that for all Sugino's claims that it's ISO and other people's claims that it's JIS, it's actually somewhere in between the two - of course it takes some instruments to measure the very slight differences. and then they went on to say some other stuff, but dammit if i can't remember where it was written - here? their website? - or what exactly it said.
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Originally Posted by baxtefer
i'll back you up on this
I guess I could write to Phil.
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Originally Posted by Ken Cox
Does this mean the Sugino 75's will fit on my current Phil 108mm JIS spindle?
I guess I could write to Phil.
I guess I could write to Phil.
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Originally Posted by Ken Cox
Well this complicates things.
John at Businesscycles lists Sugino cranks as ISO, but other sellers list Sugino cranks as JIS.
I had assumed that Sugino made two different cranks.
By the way, John at Businesscycles recommends matching the crank bearing spindle manufacturer to the crank arm manufacturer.
So much for my plan of getting a Sugino 75 crank and putting it on the same Phil spindle I use for my Stronglight crank.
John at Businesscycles lists Sugino cranks as ISO, but other sellers list Sugino cranks as JIS.
I had assumed that Sugino made two different cranks.
By the way, John at Businesscycles recommends matching the crank bearing spindle manufacturer to the crank arm manufacturer.
So much for my plan of getting a Sugino 75 crank and putting it on the same Phil spindle I use for my Stronglight crank.
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anyone know if the DA 7610 and Hatta R9400 bottom brackets are JIS?
edit: i thought i remembered reading that suntour superbe pro stuff was ISO, but i could be wrong.
edit: i thought i remembered reading that suntour superbe pro stuff was ISO, but i could be wrong.
Last edited by sers; 03-19-07 at 08:51 PM.
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i've got a dura ace spindle, which is jis.
i've got a sugino 109 track spindle, which would be iso.
i've got a set of superbe pros and 75s. the cranks sit further out on the da spindle whereas sit further in and not creating an off chainline. the situation is the same for both. so in my experience, 75s and superbe pros are iso rather than jis.
i like the idea that people are emailing phil wood about this rather than listening to the information from sugino. seriously.
i've got a sugino 109 track spindle, which would be iso.
i've got a set of superbe pros and 75s. the cranks sit further out on the da spindle whereas sit further in and not creating an off chainline. the situation is the same for both. so in my experience, 75s and superbe pros are iso rather than jis.
i like the idea that people are emailing phil wood about this rather than listening to the information from sugino. seriously.
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Originally Posted by dmg
Ruh roh. So, uh, what would happen if one was to use 75s with a shimano UNxx BB?
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Here's the old thread -->https://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-261290.html . It seems that people are saying if you ran an ISO crank with a JIS BB, you should stick with the JIS and everything should be cool.
So, like, I have this, uh, friend who got a bike put together by a shop with 75s and a shimano BB following an accident by way of a sweet sweet insurance payout. This guy, let's call him "Dee McGee", has ridden this bike only on rollers for a couple hundred miles since getting it. Should I tell him to get an ISO crank, or is the damage done and he should keep using JIS shizz in the future?
So, like, I have this, uh, friend who got a bike put together by a shop with 75s and a shimano BB following an accident by way of a sweet sweet insurance payout. This guy, let's call him "Dee McGee", has ridden this bike only on rollers for a couple hundred miles since getting it. Should I tell him to get an ISO crank, or is the damage done and he should keep using JIS shizz in the future?
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I guess the worst case scenario of running a JIS BB on an ISO crank is deforming the crankarm permanently. This could result in a less than optimal fit and would also mean you can't switch BB's afterwards.
I switched from UN54 to Campy after a wek of riding, with no deformation issues. Best bet would to have a very well informed bike mechanic to look at it.
I switched from UN54 to Campy after a wek of riding, with no deformation issues. Best bet would to have a very well informed bike mechanic to look at it.
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well there is none as deform the crank... the crank will fit but not so deep or deeper as it suppouse to be ... I have run campy track crancks with a shimano dura ace for years and no problems but u have to get the right lenght, thecnically u can get away mixing iso and jis, the question is if it is right to do it. Yes Sugino uses iso BBs, weird isnt? Campagnolo makes 111mm bbs because thats what it fits to their cranks, thats all.
Campy 102 mms fits ok with miche cranks just in case. Dunno how the sugino 109 bb it will fit with them, have to find it out. between the 109 and the campy 111 are only 1 mm per side so no big deal unless the campy bb is not symetrical, thing that I really dont know.
have fun
Campy 102 mms fits ok with miche cranks just in case. Dunno how the sugino 109 bb it will fit with them, have to find it out. between the 109 and the campy 111 are only 1 mm per side so no big deal unless the campy bb is not symetrical, thing that I really dont know.
have fun
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you'd have to put a SERIOUS amount of force into putting an iso crank on a jis bottom bracket to really mess it up. it just won't seat that far onto the spindle. of course, going back the other way may cause a problem because you've effectively stretched out the spindle to put it in a dirty kind of way. but if it's deformed slightly to a jis taper, it'll be fine if you keep using a jis taper bb.
this is another part of why i think octalink, isis and mega exo/hollowtech II/gigapipe are much better solutions to this kind of problem.
this is another part of why i think octalink, isis and mega exo/hollowtech II/gigapipe are much better solutions to this kind of problem.
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Originally Posted by dmg
Here's the old thread -->https://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-261290.html . It seems that people are saying if you ran an ISO crank with a JIS BB, you should stick with the JIS and everything should be cool.
So, like, I have this, uh, friend who got a bike put together by a shop with 75s and a shimano BB following an accident by way of a sweet sweet insurance payout. This guy, let's call him "Dee McGee", has ridden this bike only on rollers for a couple hundred miles since getting it. Should I tell him to get an ISO crank, or is the damage done and he should keep using JIS shizz in the future?
So, like, I have this, uh, friend who got a bike put together by a shop with 75s and a shimano BB following an accident by way of a sweet sweet insurance payout. This guy, let's call him "Dee McGee", has ridden this bike only on rollers for a couple hundred miles since getting it. Should I tell him to get an ISO crank, or is the damage done and he should keep using JIS shizz in the future?
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Somebody should start a poll for Sugino 75 crank users. Options are what type of BB they use: Shimano (JIS), Campy (ISO), Phil (JIS), Phil (ISO), Sugino (???)