Why I will never buy a TREK.
#51
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It is rare but the shop is really cool. Say what you want about the guy he built a very neat bike shop. The shop also sold Cannondale at one point I don't know if they still do. I don't love Trek or Trek stores generally but he had a pretty shop with some cool stuff around and good staff. I haven't been back in years but have been a few times and really neat place but I love bike shops in general so L.A. or not I would probably enjoy it.
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#53
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Fine. If your knickers are still twisted over something that happened a long time ago, and you feel that strongly about it, don't buy a Trek. It's your right to express your opinion with your pocketbook, as well as here. Other folks also have the right to have a different opinion.
What kind of bike are you currently looking to buy, and what manufacturers are you looking at?
What kind of bike are you currently looking to buy, and what manufacturers are you looking at?
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Those are the bikes you are currently considering buying? Interesting mix.
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So you start a thread stating why you will never buy a Trek, but you have no plans on buying another bike? This triggers a rehash of issues from almost 20 years ago.
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Hmmm...I'm not seeing where you stated that before. Maybe it was in another thread that I missed. It seems that stating "I'll never buy a Trek" when you don't plan on buying ANY bike is just stomping your feet to get attention.
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I am not saying it was OK I am saying. those people thought it was OK at the time. ... so yes now people recognize it was wrong but at that time it was fine in that circle. Our opinions may have changed in that time and certainly in some degrees the UCI has changed (though bike weights are still high) but what happened back then hasn't changed it was as it was
Again I not saying doping is OK, I am saying at the time in the pro peloton they thought it was OK.
Again I not saying doping is OK, I am saying at the time in the pro peloton they thought it was OK.
They'd been doing anti-doping testing of riders at the TdF since the 1960s. When Lance won in '99 and every subsequent year, doping was illegal and he was using illegal substances. His being stripped of the wins was not a retroactive application of new rules or new morality: he broke the rules as they were each time he won.
As far as what your twisted excuses are apologizing for, I really don't know, but it's something. It could be for Lance, it could be Trek, it could be for some family or friend of yours who was involved, it could be a gnawing sense of resentment knowing people out there might look down on you for riding a Trek even though you spent a lot of money on it...I dunno. What I do know is that whatever you're on about is irrelevant to my position, because I dislike Trek for what they did to Lemond.
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My comment was to the effect that I never plan to buy a bike. I always think I have too many. Then I end up buying another. So, really, who knows?
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#62
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You keep saying that, but it is not true.
They'd been doing anti-doping testing of riders at the TdF since the 1960s. When Lance won in '99 and every subsequent year, doping was illegal and he was using illegal substances. His being stripped of the wins was not a retroactive application of new rules or new morality: he broke the rules as they were each time he won.
As far as what your twisted excuses are apologizing for, I really don't know, but it's something. It could be for Lance, it could be Trek, it could be for some family or friend of yours who was involved, it could be a gnawing sense of resentment knowing people out there might look down on you for riding a Trek even though you spent a lot of money on it...I dunno. What I do know is that whatever you're on about is irrelevant to my position, because I dislike Trek for what they did to Lemond.
They'd been doing anti-doping testing of riders at the TdF since the 1960s. When Lance won in '99 and every subsequent year, doping was illegal and he was using illegal substances. His being stripped of the wins was not a retroactive application of new rules or new morality: he broke the rules as they were each time he won.
As far as what your twisted excuses are apologizing for, I really don't know, but it's something. It could be for Lance, it could be Trek, it could be for some family or friend of yours who was involved, it could be a gnawing sense of resentment knowing people out there might look down on you for riding a Trek even though you spent a lot of money on it...I dunno. What I do know is that whatever you're on about is irrelevant to my position, because I dislike Trek for what they did to Lemond.
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I can't get over the speech he made to Peter Le Fleur in Dodgeball. That crossed the line.
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Man, people can’t help but talk about Lance! Even when we’re not talking about Lance, they still want to talk about Lance. It’s like a homoerotic fetish cult. Maybe that’s another reason I don’t like Trek.
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The reality was that a large majority of the peloton was doping. It was pretty much considered standard operating procedure at the time, and it's been well documented. Was Lance on something that others weren't? Probably. Anyone believing that everyone else was clean is just willful ignorance, at this point. If you hate Lance for his doping use, that's fine. Personally, I have less issue with that aspect than I do with how he treated those around him during that time (including his influence in the Trek-Lemond situation). That said, during those years, I sure liked watching him race bicycles. I was quite disappointed to find out what an @$$hole he really was.
Yeah I agree the doping was almost mandatory in that era and that wasn’t LA’s fault. But his arrogance and conceit was on another level. I guess that was what eventually led to his downfall too. Looking back I would blame the dodgy team owners and their docs for what the sport became. Not the young riders who just did what they thought was necessary.
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Not even Lance rides a Trek any more. Look at that. You're just like Lance!
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Yeah I agree the doping was almost mandatory in that era and that wasn’t LA’s fault. But his arrogance and conceit was on another level. I guess that was what eventually led to his downfall too. Looking back I would blame the dodgy team owners and their docs for what the sport became. Not the young riders who just did what they thought was necessary.
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I actually don't have some vendetta wish towards Lance because of his cheating. He cheated. He got caught. He was held accountable. I do though despise his actions of reprisal toward people like LeMond, the Andreu's, the team masseuse, the reporter who outed him and many others. He went out to destroy them personally and financially. For that he is scum IMO. But, that wasn't the point of my post. TREK ignored his fraud and went after anyone who threatened their bottom line, regardless of the truth. They did what corporate America does to us every day. When a corporation works against my interests, I do not support them. I posted that LeMond video because it was new to me and offered some additional insights about the incident. Not all corporations are the same. Do you remember when Specialized went after the Roubaix bike shop in Montreal? They sued the local mom and pop bike shop for using "their" Roubaix name. Ignoring, of course, the fact that they "stole" the name from the actual Roubaix town and Paris-Roubaix race. When confronted publicly, the Specialized CEO dropped the suit and apologized. I would have no problem buying a Specialized. But, that's just me. I have no prescription for anyone's behavior. You get to do whatever you think is right. Obviously.
There were no positive tests, there was no proof.
It was words from a rider completely disconnected from the situation, offering pure speculation. And from general people that had no proof.
I always ask this question- should Trek and Lance just have up and said - yep, they got me?
Was Lance a dick - sure. But there was no way in hell he, or probably anyone in the sport, would have just simply said - yep the masseuse was right, y’all got me.
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...
Again I not saying doping is OK, I am saying at the time in the pro peloton they thought it was OK. I think doping is wrong however I will say if the majority (87% I believe) of those involved are doping the person who wins at that race is the winner. It is not like you or I could start doing the same doping as the pros were doing back then and win there still was a lot of training and ability there even if clouded by doping. That all being said to reiterate just to be crystal clear DOPING IS NOT OK.
I am still curious how I am a Trek apologist?
Again I not saying doping is OK, I am saying at the time in the pro peloton they thought it was OK. I think doping is wrong however I will say if the majority (87% I believe) of those involved are doping the person who wins at that race is the winner. It is not like you or I could start doing the same doping as the pros were doing back then and win there still was a lot of training and ability there even if clouded by doping. That all being said to reiterate just to be crystal clear DOPING IS NOT OK.
I am still curious how I am a Trek apologist?
And above all, LA lied. Not once or twice but for over a decade all the time. To pretend that Trek and other insiders did not know? That what LA told Greg Lemond, his wife and others from his hospital during his cancer never came back to Trek? The Amgen sponsorship and partnership, Amgen being the major producer of EPO and the Postal/Discovery team the most sophisticated used of EPO was coincidence? Was Trek really that naive or blind? (When GL spoke up, I never sensed that Trek said "Huh! Maybe he's on to something. Let's look further." No, it was "Stuff this as fast as possible!"
#71
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Trek turned the best local bike chain in Portland into Trek showrooms. Places where you used to be able to wheel any bike in, get it fixed or buy parts to keep it running. Now it feels like trying to by old VW parts at a Tesla dealership. (My repainted '83 Trek frame that is my fix gear workhorse would be neither recognized or welcomed.)
Trek purchased a chain of bike shops and has shifted the focus to Trek products and not products made by their competition to turn the business into something profitable enough to remain viable moving forward. You hold them in low esteem.
I'm not a big fan of Trek's approach to bike shops, but I'd rather there be a Trek bike store than no bike store at all. Trek and Specialized aren't forcing these independent shop owners out. The owners are struggling and looking for a way out of the business. They're happy to get paid for their business by the big evil corporations but get presented as victims by the cycling population.
The shareholders of big corporations (including all of us with any sort of retirement or investment accounts) demand increased revenue and profits so the value of our shares increase and we get more dividends so we can retire sooner, buy more things, etc. This causes the big corporate bike brands to transition the stores they buy to focus on selling their goods so they can meet those demands.
Why is it that nearly nobody acknowledges that we the citizens are demanding conflicting things for our own benefits. Corporate greed is just another variation on the individual greed that permeates our society. We want it all and want someone or everyone else to be willing to give up something so that we can have more of what we want.
End of rant...
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Trek turned the best local bike chain in Portland into Trek showrooms. Places where you used to be able to wheel any bike in, get it fixed or buy parts to keep it running. Now it feels like trying to by old VW parts at a Tesla dealership. (My repainted '83 Trek frame that is my fix gear workhorse would be neither recognized or welcomed.)
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My last several visits I have gone out empty handed. Each time REI has what I needed. REI had a mechanic who understood what I was looking for, knew where the box of those parts was, brought it out and I picked out exactly what I needed. The Trek showroom? "We got rid of all that stuff."
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What, never?
No,never!
What, NEVER?
Well...hardly ever!
He's ll hardly ever sick at sea buy a Trek!
I can't GUARANTEE I'll never buy a Trek, but I don't think it's likely. Nothing against the company, I just don't have room!
No,never!
What, NEVER?
Well...hardly ever!
He'
I can't GUARANTEE I'll never buy a Trek, but I don't think it's likely. Nothing against the company, I just don't have room!
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